Dragonia
Hey, I said my experience is still quite limited! I wouldn't be surprised if a good player with two proven cruiser designs could take down an average mauler and its player, but I don't know about a proven mauler design with a reasonably skilled player.

Also, if your refering to the Draco, I do believe the Shaman were using all 3 cruisers, I think you told me the Draco cannot repair itself, and I'm guessing it doesn't have many swarm generators.

Lord Nova
by reducing the cost of large ships by a little and increasing small ship costs by a lot (comparatively) I think you might by reducing the size of in-system fleets. In other words, the opposite of what I was trying to do when I suggested some numbers. (I did it by merely lowering large class and middle class ship costs to comparatively increase their amount allowed compared to small ships.) You could say I prefer battles to duels, but that merely defines extremes-not our respective ideas.

All and Sundry
I think if you increase fighter and frigate costs by even 1, you kill the small ship swarm strategy completely. Because I'm refering to the ace in the hole I still have that Mappie did not, I'll refrain from mentioning just why this is right now. (Though logic might lead you to it.) If a majority of people disagree or Jonathan requests just what this is, I'll reveal it even though I was hoping to confuse and terrorize-the first match at least ;) (it will be apparent over time). Oh, and the reason you kill the swarm strategy is because fighters and frigates can easily be taken out by mines, generally. The high power low warhead mines are especially nasty (fighters and frigates generally don't have many swarm generators). And a middle class ship can easily lay them, albeit at a rate of 1 per turn. Actually I might not be able to stop those mines... I may have to rethink a tad....

Jonathan wrote:

I guess my real aim is that mixed fleets should always fair better than fleets of the same ship type. Currently maulers always lose, and even battleships have trouble. Part of it is cost but mostly it is the massed armour that frigates and cruisers get clad in. Which is actually great - cruisers survive against maulers. BUT, maulers end up on their own, which is not fine.

Well now... I think these points should be focused on, because Jonathan hit things spot on. My previous balancing of costs allowed a greater amount of higher class ships in, as well allowing them support from lower classes. This addressed the top point by allowing a greater variety of ships, but costs weren't even (figuratively) so you couldn't really field a fleet filled with same class ships. It addresses the middle point and bottom points by allowing larger ships more back-up than previously.

hey, I didn't say the draco couldn't repair itself! it's just maulers are the hardest ship of all to repair due to it taking 6 mass just to heal 1 section., which personally I don't agree with, even with them being so big, I think it should still be max 5 mass to heal 1.
but, eh, that's just me.

and hey, why you giving away the stats of my ship for?

anyway, I'm not pretending to be an ace of the game myself, I still have yet to really 'win' any conflicts...

I never claimed my memory infallible. ;)

And your not alone with that last.

I think I will implement my new points. If it is still wrong then I can adjust them again.

Jonathan

Works for me.

Hmmm... I suppose this will mean the Nosferatu won't be as high above their max ship limit as they once were.... *Shivers.*

The ship count on the race stats is including all trade gates. Give the number of Nosferatu colonies I'd guess at least a hundred of those "ships" are actually constructs.

Ha! That makes it slightly better, but not much. Thanks anyway.

I just had an interesting thought... since maulers are already such 'weak' ships (so slow and little support) how about instead of unnerfing there combat ability, how about we instead give players a reason to use specifically maulers?

what I was thinking was a 'sector bonus' for fielding a mauler, however I'm not actually sure atm what this bonus would be... whether increased taxes in system... or a combat bonus to other ships in area (call it a leadership bonus for having a mauler flagship, idk)

anyway, like I said, perhaps we could just throw in a special bonus that would only apply to having a mauler, or perhaps dreadnaughts as well, and then double for maulers. (since dreadnaughts are still technically the same problem... just idk if as bad or not)

Tricky this - I deliberately missed off buffs and tech trees. Darklight and pts per drone are the equivalent. And as such, it's hard to add such things back in.

Also, since the topic has gone pretty silent I presume we can leave things as they are...